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  • So, this is my first post here, and I want to talk about something important. As the title suggests, did Milo Murphy's Law go through seasonal rot during season 2? On the one hand, I've heard people who think the more story driven angle was pretty well done and like Doofenshmirtz' character arc. On the other hand, there are those who think the MML cast (mainly the main trio) got reduced to supporting characters in their own show, and Doofenshmirtz took up too much screen time. What do you think?

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    • I have MANY thoughts on the subject, and while I don't yet have the time, I would be more than glad to share my LONG essay about this subject during the next few days. Incredibly short answer: YES

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    • Well, it is true that a lot of people didn't like Doofenshmirtz's appearance in Season 2. But I personally felt that it was a good way to develop his character: which may eventually lead to the idea of Professor Time. As I've heard, putting Dr. D was Disney's idea, and Season 2 isn't that bad. You still see the trio often, it's just that there are many more "main characters" which is why the trio seem to be less frequent.

      Might this be true that Disney is still trying to include Phineas and Ferb because of its popularity? But they can't because of its 4-season policy? Maybe this is the case: and that is why they are trying to bring Phineas and Ferb here.

      The inclusion of Doof might also signify the story of Professor Time, which is why he needed to play a big role in Season 2. That would make it easier to create the episode, or movie (or series, who knows?), where, in the future, 2 years after "Act Your Age", we will see something about that. Both "Phineas and Ferb" and "Milo Murphy's Law" characters will be there. What do you think?

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    • Personally, I don't think Milo Murphy's Law has gone through seasonal rot yet. I definitely understand why some people believe it has, but that's mostly because of the overexposure of Doofenshmirtz (which was mostly Disney's idea anyway). I personally didn't have a problem with Doof at all.

      Moreover, some of my most favorite episodes are actually in Season 2. My personal OTP for this show is evolving in a natural way as well.

      I have heard about the complaint that Melissa and Zack don't appear as often as they'd like, but... don't they? They may appear a little less than Season 1, but they still appear a lot throughout the season. Enough times for me to not really notice a decrease in appearances. Melissa, for instance, was only completely absent in three out of 37 episodes, while in Season 1, it's one out of 36.

      So overall, I don't think Milo Murphy's Law had gone through much of a seasonal rot, if at all. And even if it did, I don't think it's as bad as the seasonal rot Star vs the Forces of Evil has gotten.

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    • I get all that, but I must correct you guys about Doof. See, Dan and Swampy before S4 ended wanted to make a Doof spinoff (hence DOOF 101 and Agents of O.W.C.A, they were backdoor pilots). Disney, however, said that both wouldn't be popular enough. So they asked for a new show. And guess which character appears in the second season of a show that was created but a year later?

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    • The Milo Murphy's Law Wiki Guy wrote: I get all that, but I must correct you guys about Doof. See, Dan and Swampy before S4 ended wanted to make a Doof spinoff (hence DOOF 101 and Agents of O.W.C.A, they were backdoor pilots). Disney, however, said that both wouldn't be popular enough. So they asked for a new show. And guess which character appears in the second season of a show that was created but a year later?

      Clearly, you haven't seen Dan and Swampy's interview with Piper that I have shared on this very wiki a while ago... twice.

      In that interview, they very clearly stated that Disney themselves suggested to them to add Doof to the main cast, and Dan and Swampy made it work.

      True, they also said they wanted to implement PnF characters in Milo's show (like, little cameos and small appearances and such), but Doof being a main character was specifically Disney's request for Season 2.

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    • I didn't see that, true. But look at those backdoor pilots. Look at The Phineas and Ferb movie that copies or reuses old concepts from the show. Why are Dan and Swanoy doing something that didn't new in the slightest?

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    • And if you wants a better summery of my feelings (very brief but still) try the Heinz Poochieshmirtz video that was released on youtube

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    • Also Arend, white it is true that Zack and Melissa apoeared often, the criticism is that the did almost no thing but look up. REALLY thing of what the did from a CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT place. What do they actually do? No, saving subplots didn't enough. How do they change? Besides looking up and Zack shiwing bravery ONCE in the finale

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    • The Milo Murphy's Law Wiki Guy wrote: Also Arend, white it is true that Zack and Melissa apoeared often, the criticism is that the did almost no thing but look up. REALLY thing of what the did from a CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT place. What do they actually do? No, saving subplots didn't enough. How do they change? Besides looking up and Zack shiwing bravery ONCE in the finale

      Well, I do vividly remember that you were bothered by Melissa not appearing as much as you'd like, so I thought that would've also been a factor to seasonal rot.

      As for the character development thing, I see what you mean: while we do have character development for some of the supporting characters (such as Amanda), the main three don't go through as much (Zack goes through some in Mid-Afternoon Snack Club and Sphere and Loathing in Outer Space, but that's about it I guess).

      HOWEVER, after much time to think about it, I don't think it's fair to say that the lack of character development is a good reason as to say that Milo's gone through seasonal rot.

      Why?

      Well, tell me what kind of character development Milo, Melissa or Zack went through in Season 1.

      If your answer is "practically nothing", then you'd be correct, because I can't really think of much in that season, either.

      Yeah, there was this episode about Melissa facing her fear for rollercoasters, but that fear had never been brought up before that episode, nor had the events in said episode been brought up again. You could've removed Murphy's Lard out, and nothing would've changed.

      If you dislike the lack of main character development in Season 2, shouldn't you dislike the lack of main character development in Season 1 either? And if you had no problem with a lack of main character development in Season 1, then why is it a problem with Season 2, then?

      Shouldn't this count as a problem of the show as a whole, instead of a factor of seasonal rot?

      Season 2 may have actually been an improvement concerning character development on the main characters, as it at least tried something with Zack in the end.

      and it may have also tried something with Melissa in the beginning, as she seemed very concerned about Milo and Zack showing up late when the bus arrived at school in Snow Way Out, when she was still quite confident about it in class back in Going the Extra Milo

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    • And don't forget about Melissa and Zack's relationship. While it may not be much, it did develop a bit in Season 2.

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    • The Milo Murphy's Law Wiki Guy wrote:
      And if you wants a better summery of my feelings (very brief but still) try the Heinz Poochieshmirtz video that was released on youtube

      I've seen the video just now and need to clarify a few points. About things always going right for Phineas and Ferb, in Summer Belongs To You, they still manage to make it in time, so that works out for them. All of their inventions throughout the entire series disappear for good, so that Linda doesn't bust them and they can do what they want. While it may seem that they have failed in a lot of episodes, they do eventually succeed, hence justifying the positive effect. It's not because they have worked hard to be what they are, they're just really lucky, and that's why things always work out for them. Ideas come to their minds because they 're lucky enough to make their lives amazing.

      Heinz tries to be good in a particular episode, as you can remember. So it's not always that he's not doing anything. Morever, he has a terrible past, was always ignored by people, which is why he eventually deserves something good.

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    • I think Zack got more character development than you might think. It just doesn't seem like it because it mostly consists of little moments, like Zack thinking his way out of their predicament in The Llama Incident and doing it again in Mid-Afternoon Snack Club. He also uses the items in Milo's backpack twice in Snow Way Out and he handles being run over by the giant snowball a lot better than almost being run over by the section of concrete drainage pipe in Going the Extra Milo.

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    • I do agree about the lack of development in S1. In fact, it's a major problem throughout the entire show. Now, I get why you people think that S2 wasn't as bad as I say, and I respect that, but try to think about this: The main thing you've all said so far about development is that Milo didn't develop (protagonist's that don't develop are usually (note: USUALLY) flat, and it's insane that someone with his potential never really changes), Melissa has the rollercoaster episode, the snow episode, and kissing Zack (our Deautrogonist's development consists of gaining and defeating a fear in 11 minutes, getting worried for Milo and Zack ONCE and kissing someone she's had poor writing with), and Zack shows about 3 flashes of getting less afraid (admittedly the best of the three here, but still).

      Think for a moment about this: 3 main characters who don't remotely change, outside of very tiny steps. I know that Phineas and Ferb was like that as well (sort of) but the reason it was like that was because of formula, and they made up for it by having loooooooong arcs for Candace, Doof, Vanessa, ETC.

      But Milo Murphy's Law ISN'T SUPPOSED TO BE PHINEAS AND FERB. And even the supporting characters who are supposed to have arcs barely change. Orton Mahlson? Thrown out for Doof. Dakota? Rarely phased, never learns a lesson. Cavendish? Learns that Dakota saves his life on a daily basis and still treats him like shit, and I bet you in S3 he'll still be doing that.

      Block, Savannah, and Brick are characters PACKED TO THE BRIM with potential, but even static characters like Monogram and Carl are more likable because they set something up and did't bother paying up.

      Let me give you perhaps the best example of this: Look at Phineas and Ferb. Name me memorable and fun supporting characters. You can do that all day!

      Now look at Milo (and be objective!). How many ACTUALLY do you like? Not like "Well, Principal Milder had that one line which was sort of funny" or "I guess Zack's Mom had a nice voice". I mean, like in the sense of "Oh man MEAP! Bring him back!" and "You know what was a great running gag? Planty the Plant!".

      if you're struggling, perhaps that's a sign that a show that refused to use a massive cast it already had in favor of making Phineas and Ferb references might be making a mistake.

      And let's be real here: Phineas and Ferb, for all its flaws, knew that when the chips were down, it was IMPORTANT to show its characters FEEL. Phineas would shout at Candace, Candace would save the boys, Doof would save the world for a moment, Perry would smile proudly at him, Vanessa really does love her dad, ETC. These caricatures had moments of heart when they were called for, which is why most of the specials are well liked.

      Milo's family and friends are enslaved by an alien race he's responsible for by way of genetic condition he can do nothing about. They're all going to be replaced by plants. People he was told he would hurt by being close to them and he didn't listen are now in literal mortal danger, and he's so unlucky that trying to save them might make it even worse. He's ruined the past, present and future, and he's got zero time.

      The smile on his face never wavers, because that would mean the show would have to actually try with him, instead of go the easy route and shove him aside for the Phineas and Ferb characters.

      Guys, if this was just Disney, Dan and Swampy wouldn't be making an entire movie they've been trying to make for years and setting it in summer. I assure you Disney would greenlight Phineas and Ferb: Hipsters in Apartments if it would make a shitotn of money. Slap the brand name on anything, it might just work. People would gobble up a sequel show... But not only would they gobble up a movie that literally has nothing original in it, but it's just EASIER.

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    • Amanda is definitely one of the more memorable supporting characters given how she has a concrete personality yet has a range of emotion. As for everyone else, yeah I agree with you. They're not terrible, but hardly memorable.

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    • Lots I agree with. Somethings I don't fully agree with. There are definitely valid criticisms but over all I enjoyed season 2. I don't think it's in a rot.

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    • PhinFerbFan5 wrote:
      Lots I agree with. Somethings I don't fully agree with. There are definitely valid criticisms but over all I enjoyed season 2. I don't think it's in a rot.

      Agreed. Over use of Doof? Yeah, thats a valid argument, but rot? No. The show ended and left us all wanting a third season. To my mind that's a sign that the show has not suffered from rot, or at least if it has, then only very, very minimally.

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    • You can miss a show and still think it has declined. Tangled went through a HUGE hiatus, and I thought the first half of S2 was meh. The second half massively improved on it.

      Anyway, I don't think the show ROTTED, as much as I think that Dan and Swampy have sort of given up on it as well (Disney did not help in this matter, since they clearly don't care about MML). If someone can tell me how this Phineas and Ferb movie adds ANYTHING to Phineas and Ferb that hasn't already been added, I would love to hear that, since it seems to me to be just the same old things again.

      I do agree about Amanda though: She's arguably the only character who had an arc and stuck with it in this show. I honestly praise the writing for her. Everyone else though never got that chance. And when a show clearly promises story arcs and then just half asses it, then we have a problem.

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    • I don't think Dan and Swampy have exactly given up on Milo, as they still occasionally (re)tweet/like pleas for Season 3 (this one, for example). Plus, according to Joshua Pruett, the staff still has lots of ideas they want to explore (Pruett even states he has an endgame for a lot of things). All that seems completely contradictory to your theory about Dan and Swampy not wanting to continue Milo anymore.

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    • Many shows have its own problems nowadays. MML has some too, but those aren't really anything for us to be freaking out. Now I still enjoy watching back all of MML episodes (though in a lesser level). There are this and that opinions but I believe that there's not much for me to be worrying about.

      Disney doesn't even care about MML in the first place. Other than that, I'll just have to see the new P&F movie though it's clearly that there will be same points all over again in the P&F series... After the movie is something should be concerned.

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    • I would like to rephrase myself, since Arend is right: Dan and Swampy do want to continue Milo. How ever I feel that they will only makes an other So if centered season where everyone is static. Believe me: Phineas and Ferb season 5 will happens, and it will be before the finale of s4. Because they don't want to lesve their comfort zone. After all, may I remind you what is the only project they ever headed that was successful? Exactly

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    • And that seems completely contradictory to Disney's own 4-season rule. A lot of Disney Channel shows are not going further than 4 seasons, that's a fact.

      Believe me, Season 5 is unlikely, unless Disney themselves get greedy, and bend their own rules, trying to convince Dan and Swampy to make it happen.

      Also you might wanna type your messages a bit slower. It's almost becoming unreadable. It took me a GREAT while to figure out what "So if" meant

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    • Sorry, man. Also, yes, I know of the rule. I also know that Disney (as much as I love the people who MAKE the art) are greedy. Dude, the chances of a 5th season are way more likely than not. And Dan and Swampy have no other successes. They'll find it hard to say no. And deep down, I don't think they want to say no. Again, they wanted a Doof spinoff.

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    • I hope you understand that I am HAPPY you liked S2. I'm not saying you shouldn't. Neither am I saying you shouldn't be excited for the movie. Just try and see my POV. Some of the actions Dan, Swampy, Disney and the others have been doing aren't exactly what I'd call "daring to do something new". And when a show says "we have story arcs" and does nothing with that, I call that a failure.

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    • I don't know what you guys think, but in my POV, Disney is obssesed with F&P. Throughout years, P&F has proved its influence and popularity all over the world. The first episode of P&F was aired on August 17, 2007. Ever since, the frachise has become popular all over the globe. 12 years has gone by, 4 seasons has been aired and 9 special P&F has been published too. And I still cannot understand why Disney doesn't let P&F rest in peace ? P&F is preventing both Disney and Dan & Swampy from doing something new like MML.

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    • EXACTLY! Mr. H gets it! All three enteties here are just too afraid to try!

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    • Perhaps the movie is being done because it's an incomplete project from years before. Plus the popularity thing.

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    • The movie is happening because Disney wants content for Disney+. Of course they could also greenlight season 3 and get content for D+.

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    • A FANDOM user
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